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asked in Transcribing Images by tuckersmom BG Explorer (1.2k points)

3 Answers

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https://billiongraves.com/transcribe?media_id=9817555

I f this is what you are asking about, I could not find even a suggestion on the net of what it might mean. I post the link to an example in case someone else has an understanding of the meaning.

DS
answered by dswright BG Master (37.9k points)
Thank you. It's driving me crazy. I've been skipping those stones. 'I' means 'and' so I thought maybe it was a form of that, or that the name might have been Vecovidic and is now Vedic.
I am still curious so I sent an email to a Croatian language group I found online. Will let you know what I find out if anything.

DS
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We have somewhat of an answer, with many thanks to IVA with the Croation Language Institute who kindly responded to my inquiry. Here is a recap of our email exchange:

"I am a member of a user-group that transcribes gravestone records, and wanted to know the meaning of the abreviation "PL" on some recent images. The image is at::

 https://billiongraves.com/transcribe?media_id=98175

DS
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Oh Pl. in this context stands for "plemeniti" (for a man) or "plemenita" (for a woman) meaning "noble". These people probably came from rich and noble families.

Hope that helps! :-)
Iva
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If we wanted to put that into the database, should it be as a Prefix (like English would use Sir, or Lord) or as Suffix (like Esq (Esquire), Is it considered part of the actual name or just an honorific? Thanks so much for your kind responses.

DS
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I honestly don't know what to tell you.

It's considered a part of the name, I believe. It just marks that the family was noble (so you'd put it in front of the surname) but I have no idea how the family would earn that title.

There are no "noble" families in Croatia anymore as far as I know. Or at least people don't use the title with their name.

Hope this helps, I know it's not very specific but I'm not too familiar with the term myself. :-)

All the best from Zagreb,
Iva

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NOW,  given that it is associated witht the surname/family name, should we put it after the surname in that field, or as a suffix?  I don't think I would want to put it at the beginning of the surname field, as that would make it seem to be more important than the family name. If it followed the surname then the PL would come up the search functions. If it is in the suffix field how useful is it in searching?

Even though it is before the surname on the stone, I would be inclined to put it after the surname in that field.

Any other opinions or conventions known about?

DS
answered by dswright BG Master (37.9k points)
Thank you for finding this. It make sense because I'm seeing it on older stones (https://billiongraves.com/transcribe/9406655). I can't make out the epitaphs that are included with each name.
I looked at that one and then in the alpha index of that cemetery, I see that the pl is consistently put just before the surname, without caps as in 'pl'. If you search the index you will see it done a number of different ways. You may have already done so but ...

DS
Thanks for all the info on this. I didn't actually transcribe any, yet, so I'll follow your suggestion about keying it .
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Below is a link to a site in English run by the Croatian Nobility Association which appears to be a family history type group.. It gives some idea of their usage in placing pl. before the noble family name, though elsewhere on the site it  gives the sense that the concept noble families is somewhat archaic. Its important to record whats on the headstone but I hope puttin pl. in front of the family name does not confound researchers of the Croatian diaspora from finding their ancestors on this site.

www.plemstvo.hr/History/English
answered by megabear BG Explorer (2.5k points)
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